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TEXASGUY01

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When Karl Marx Speaks, Barack Obama Listens

Seeded on Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:30 AM EST
Read ArticleArticle Source: CNSNews.com
politics, barack-obama, roman-catholic-church, karl-marx, catholic-league
Seeded by Texasguy01
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Barack Obama may have just lost the election. He has foolishly gone to war in an election year with tens of millions of Catholics, Protestants and Jews – Democrat, Republican and independent alike. He has thrown down a radical feminist gauntlet and dared the Church to pick it up.

They’ve picked it up.

From running up trillions in debt and deficit, to the vast expansion of the size and scope of federal bureaucracy, Mr. Obama has done more in three years to supplant our 236 year-old Constitutional Republic with a Euro-style socialist autocracy – than a lesser Marxist could have accomplished in a lifetime.

But controlling the purse strings is not nearly enough. A central element of full-blown secular-socialism is the suppression of religious liberty – principally, freedom of conscience.

Karl Marx once said: “The first requisite for the happiness of the people is the abolition of religion.”

When Karl Marx speaks, Barack Obama listens.

In what is perhaps the most egregious executive overreach in our lifetime, the president’s Health and Human Services (HHS) Secretary, Kathleen Sebelius, has unconstitutionally decreed that both Catholic and Protestant organizations must violate fundamental tenets of the Christian faith by providing ObamaCare coverage that includes birth control, sterilization and various forms of abortion. This is as blatant a violation of the First Amendment’s guarantee to religious “free exercise” as we’ve ever seen.

Despite two pathetic feints at “compromise,” Obama’s illegal requirement that faith-based groups pay for policies providing immoral “reproductive services” remains in full force.

 

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  • Public Discussion (238)
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Texasguy01

From the moment he falsely claimed, “Whatever we once were, we are no longer a Christian nation,” many have screamed from the rooftops that, despite his incongruous claims to be a Christ follower, Barack Obama, in reality, harbors tremendous animus toward all things Christian.

It’s not surprising, then, that – even prior to his latest act of anti-religious authoritarianism – a Pew Research Center survey had determined that, under Obama’s leadership, “the number of [religious] voters who identify as a Democrat has declined, while the number saying they lean toward the GOP has risen.”

Some highlights:

  • White evangelical Protestant support for the GOP has grown from 65 percent in 2008 to 70 percent today;
  • 80 percent of Mormons now say they identify with or lean toward the Republican Party;
  • White mainline Protestants, who were evenly divided between the parties in 2008, now favor the GOP by a 12-point margin;
  • White non-Hispanic Catholics, who gave Democrats an eight-point advantage in 2008 now give Republicans a seven-point advantage at the end of 2011 (a remarkable 15-point swing);
  • Even Jewish voters – traditionally one of the strongest Democratic constituencies – have moved noticeably in the Republican direction; Jewish voters favored the Democrats by a 52-point margin in 2008 but now prefer the Democratic Party by a significantly smaller 36-point margin.

It stands to reason that, in the wake of his most recent attack on religious freedom, Democrat’s favor with the faithful will only further erode.

  • 10 votes
#1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:31 AM EST
douglasq

Karl Marx once said: “The first requisite for the happiness of the people is the abolition of religion.”

Karl Marx also said:

Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.

Kind of explains how fundamentalism thrives in impoverished populations and those suffering under harsh conditions. It also explains jailhouse and death row conversions.

That said, your headline is inaccurate in that you cannot point to an instance of Obama looking to Marx for guidance in governing. To say otherwise is just dishonest.

  • 54 votes
#1.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:53 AM EST
FLYNAVY1

...your headline is inaccurate in that you cannot point to an instance of Obama looking to Marx for guidance in governing.To say otherwise is just dishonest.

Honesty hasn't been in-vogue with the GOP since Eisenhower.

Republicans can't run against the real Obama, so they had to invent one to justify their hate.

  • 54 votes
#1.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:09 PM EST
HappyToSeeYa

the open teapublicon attacks on women's reproductive rights claimed as an attack on religious liberties will not have the results that teapublicons desire

  • 29 votes
#1.3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:10 PM EST
Mark R-338142

I posted this earlier in reply to an article calling Obama a despot. It seems equally relevant here as a reply to this latest absurdity......

To call this an insane and irrational diatribe from the depths of a mind suffering, it would seem, from rampant galloping clinical paranoia is a majestic understatement. Have Teapublicans finally lost all sense of reality? After 3 years of Barack Obama in the White House, their racist incoherence and emotionally neurotic prejudices seem finally to have taken over their thought centers and slaughtered all rationality.

In short.......They've become a bunch of pure-bred LOONIES ! ! !

  • 28 votes
#1.4 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:18 PM EST
Pallas Athene

Marx was spot on about many things, many colleges around the world study his works still to this day as he was a brilliant man of his time, and very right about a great many things. It's only we as American's who are spoon fed propaganda all our lives that see this man as some kind of adolph hitler redux, it's sad really.

The fundies are dividing America once again, it's true the wingnuts don't support Obama as the OP says, but lets cut the BS, the fact is they NEVER did. Obama didn't need them his first election , he will not need them in this one. "The fence sitters" will decide this one, like usually, and the Zealots running things currently in the GOP are pushing the sitters over the fence right into Obamas lap. The OP puts numbers up that look pretty impressive, but those numbers include moderate Christians as well as the extreme right wing types, the actual number of Christians that are into "far right politics" is thankfully still a tiny fraction of your overall sum you presented....just saying ;).

  • 16 votes
#1.5 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:34 PM EST
swagg

What's the beef with birth control, I think that in itself will help stem spending. More women being responsible, leaves less reasons for government intervention in family affairs. We all know the radicals love the government when they are infringing on peoples lives, but hate them when they wanna help to improve peoples lives..

  • 12 votes
#1.6 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:43 PM EST
hvymtl83

When Karl Marx speaks? You do realize the dude's dead, right? I mean, I really don't think that a guy who's been dead for over a century really speaks to anyone, do you? Of course, if one is sufferring from extreme ODS (Obama Derangement Syndrome), then one can imagine hearing all kinds of voices.

  • 23 votes
#1.7 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:44 PM EST
spankola

When Karl Marx Speaks, Barack Obama Listens

Maybe, but when Harpo Marx speaks it is NEWS!

  • 8 votes
#1.8 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:44 PM EST
mountainmike-1199289

You have the wrong Marx brother.

Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.
Groucho Marx

Read more:http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/g/groucho_marx_3.html#ixzz1mHyzSeHc

  • 17 votes
#1.9 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:46 PM EST
Cob the Crazed

Love all the rants and name calling about Republicans. Liberal Democrat zealots did the same thing two years ago when the lost the house, and a ton of seats in the Senate. Keep it up guys, you can callus Teapublicans or teabaggers, or whatever you wish. Happily thanks to the constitution Obama constantly tries to violate, you'll be able to continue to call us all those names after Obama loses his re-election in November. Obama is becoming the Bush of 2008, meaning you could run an old shoe against him and still win.

  • 5 votes
#1.10 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:54 PM EST
spankola

In what is perhaps the most egregious executive overreach in our lifetime, the president’s Health and Human Services (HHS) Secretary, Kathleen Sebelius, has unconstitutionally decreed that both Catholic and Protestant organizations must violate fundamental tenets of the Christian faith by providing ObamaCare coverage that includes birth control, sterilization and various forms of abortion. This is as blatant a violation of the First Amendment’s guarantee to religious “free exercise” as we’ve ever seen.

Overreach my tuches!, you are having a right wing spasm. Oral contraception/Religion issue was decided by the SCOTUS over 10 years ago based on the Civil Rights act as a matter of sex discrimination.

The Reagan Administration holds the modern day Executive Over Reach Prize by waging their own private war: Iran-Contra.

  • 11 votes
#1.11 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:59 PM EST
douglasq

Maybe, but when Harpo Marx speaks it is NEWS!

You have the wrong Marx brother.

@mountainmike-1199289

That one sailed right over your head, didn't it? Harpo was the Marx brother who never spoke. Get it? ;-)

  • 12 votes
#1.12 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:00 PM EST
Perception Dominates Reality

What is with this Conservative lie?? Shameless

In short, Catholic bishops are saying that federal laws shouldn't apply to anyone who claims to have a religious objection to them. Houses of worship and other religious nonprofits are already completely exempt from the rule. It is only when religious institutions choose to go into business as hospitals and serve the general public that they are bound by the same laws as everyone else. Yet the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops has promised a legal challenge.

Um...except:

President Barack Obama's decision to require most employers to cover birth control and insurers to offer it at no cost has created a firestorm of controversy. But the central mandate-that most employers have to cover preventative care for women-has been law for over a decade. This point has been completely lost in the current controversy, as Republican presidential candidates and social conservatives claim that Obama has launched a war on religious liberty and the Catholic Church.

In December 2000, the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission ruled that companies that provided prescription drugs to their employees but didn't provide birth control were in violation of Title VII of the 1964 Civil Rights Act, which prevents discrimination on the basis of sex. That opinion, which the George W. Bush administration did nothing to alter or withdraw when it took office the next month, is still in effect today - and because it relies on Title VII of the Civil Rights Act, it applies to all employers with 15 or more employees. Employers that don't offer prescription coverage or don't offer insurance at all are exempt, because they treat men and women equally-but under the EEOC's interpretation of the law, you can't offer other preventative care coverage without offering birth control coverage, too.

In other words: Shut the F-k up.

Oh and your other shameless lie, Texasguy01, is equally sickening. Maybe if you were capable of telling the truth people would take you serisouly.

From the moment he falsely claimed, “Whatever we once were, we are no longer a Christian nation,” many have screamed from the rooftops that, despite his incongruous claims to be a Christ follower, Barack Obama, in reality, harbors tremendous animus toward all things Christian.

FULL ANSWER

This is an example of how omitting a single word from an otherwise accurate quote can twist the meaning so completely as to reverse it. Here's what Obama meant to say, during his keynote address to a "Call to Renewal" conference sponsored by the progressive Christian magazine Sojourners two years ago:

Obama, June 28, 2006 (prepared remarks): Given the increasing diversity of America's population, the dangers of sectarianism have never been greater. Whatever we once were, we are no longer just a Christian nation; we are also a Jewish nation, a Muslim nation, a Buddhist nation, a Hindu nation, and a nation of nonbelievers. [emphasis mine]

  • 18 votes
#1.13 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:03 PM EST
Woody316

Love all the rants and name calling about Republicans. Liberal Democrat zealots

Love them so much you take the high road...and do the same thing. How big of you. You should keep hanging on to that victory in 2010 because it will be the only one you guys will see in probably the better part of 4 more years. When those Teabaggers (you said I could) got elected to office is was over the giant hoax of jobs, jobs, jobs when America would have elected a circus clown as long as they could help people get a job. Looking back I 'm sure the American people are wishing now they had picked "clown". All they got was sweeping abortion legislation, important issues like pizza as a veggie or "In God We Trust" motto votes. And let's not forget the cuts. The cuts to education, the cuts to the EPA. Cuts, cuts, cuts. You do realize cuts are really just a disconnected way of saying job loss. Jobs, jobs, jobs. Maybe the way that zombies always say brains, brains, brains.

  • 13 votes
#1.14 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:07 PM EST
mountainmike-1199289

douglas

That one sailed right over your head, didn't it? Harpo was the Marx brother who never spoke. Get it? ;-)

If you are my age you would know that Harpo never spoke. He had one of those 1950's bike horns that you blew by squeezing a rubber bulb. I had a bike with that type of horn on it when I was a kid, then we used a clothespin and poker card on the back wheel to sound like a motorcycle.

Where were you?

Don't pick on an old f#rt unless you are going to duck and cover. They don't call us Boomers for nothing. ( ^:

  • 8 votes
#1.15 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:14 PM EST
Woody316

Hey old timer, fart isn't a bad word anymore.

J/k, having a little fun.

  • 4 votes
#1.16 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:18 PM EST
TPisFORtheBATHROOM101

lol. Yeah,those catholics are quite the outstanding bearers of ethics and morality.

Talk is cheap. Joining their cult/religion isn't.

  • 2 votes
#1.17 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:42 PM EST
mountainmike-1199289

I'll have to bounce up and down on my whoopee cushion a few more times just to celebrate fart not being a bad word anymore.

  • 5 votes
#1.18 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:44 PM EST
mstanley2265

It's always been a matter of 'adjusting' inside and outside pressure. :)

  • 1 vote
#1.19 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:47 PM EST
Rorschach-558483

When Karl Marx speaks, Barack Obama listens.

And when right-wingers keep trying to sell this garbage, the population at large yawns.

You've lost this battle, wingnuts. You're only convincing yourselves. The rest of us just think you're nuts.

  • 10 votes
#1.20 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:56 PM EST
StevieGee

Ahh yes. Our daily anti-Obama hit piece. This time I got all the way to the second paragraph before it said that Obama created a "vast expansion of the size and scope of federal bureaucracy". When I read blatant lies in articles like this I stop reading until someone can show me and the other viners a specific instance where it is true.

  • 5 votes
#1.21 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:07 PM EST
trm2008

Seriously, why do we even bother to comment on nonsense like this?

  • 8 votes
#1.22 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:09 PM EST
mstanley2265

It seems that to Not comment, means you agree with the topic. In the case of politics, silence is not golden especially in a public forum where someone may decide how they will vote based on what they read here

  • 1 vote
#1.23 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:14 PM EST
Shuklack

Ah, the resident newsvine rightwing seeders, coming out with yet another absurd article.

Ya'll do realize that you are only serving to make yourselves out as nutcases, right? If you posted the same article on a right-wing site and it was seeded here by a lefty for mockery purposes, ya'll would be saying it was an obvious plant by lefties to make the right look bad.

  • 6 votes
#1.24 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:18 PM EST
Un-Do-It

#1.5 – Pallas Athene

Marx was spot on about many things, many colleges around the world study his works still to this day as he was a brilliant man of his time, and very right about a great many things. It's only we as American's who are spoon fed propaganda all our lives that see this man as some kind of adolph hitler redux, it's sad really.

The fundies are dividing America once again, it's true the wingnuts don't support Obama as the OP says, but lets cut the BS, the fact is they NEVER did. Obama didn't need them his first election , he will not need them in this one. "The fence sitters" will decide this one, like usually, and the Zealots running things currently in the GOP are pushing the sitters over the fence right into Obamas lap.

Obama supporter that also praises Marx?

I personally am not shocked that this person supports both. I am shocked when some Democrats are so ashamed of Marx they will not admit they support him.

    #1.25 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:49 PM EST
    Perception Dominates Reality

    trm2008
    Seriously, why do we even bother to comment on nonsense like this?

    Because someone new to Newsvine, or perhaps someone who doesn't have a name on Newsvine but still reads here, may come around and read this. And staying silent about it would be the same as agreeing with it.
    We comment because it's important to let the uninformed read the truth.

    Un-Do-It
    I personally am not shocked that this person supports both. I am shocked when some Democrats are so ashamed of Marx they will not admit they support him.

    I personally am not shocked when ignorant people try to paint other people as irrelevant because of some small correlation in belief systems to a well known historical figure. I am shocked when some Republicans are so desperate for ammo, that they denigrate ideas of wealth distribution when the majority of them follow a religion that's supposed to be patterned after the OG of wealth re-distribution to help those in need, Jesus.

    • 3 votes
    #1.26 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 4:00 PM EST
    Fred Evil

    Obama supporter that also praises Marx?

    I heard Marx liked peanut butter, and that he was also fond of elephants, how sad that conservatives would choose their mascot from a creature that Marx was so taken with.

    Very telling....

    • 3 votes
    #1.27 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 4:19 PM EST
    Greenwood10

    Obama and his "feminist" handlers just prove how important religion is because we see what happens when there is a lack of it.

    • 2 votes
    #1.28 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:10 PM EST
    Greenwood10

    From the moment he falsely claimed, Whatever we once were, we are no longer a Christian nation, many have screamed from the rooftops that, despite his incongruous claims to be a Christ follower, Barack Obama, in reality, harbors tremendous animus toward all things Christian.

    Of course, he is the wolf in sheep's clothing except that he isn't a very believeable sheep.

    • 1 vote
    #1.29 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:13 PM EST
    Perception Dominates Reality

    Greenwood10
    #1.13 clearly addresses your quoted comment is an utter lie. Now i know trolls dont read. But please spare us the trouble of repeating ourselves cause your to lazy to actively participate in full.

    • 2 votes
    #1.30 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:21 PM EST
    Un-Do-It

    #1.26

    I personally am not shocked when ignorant people try to paint other people as irrelevant because of some small correlation in belief systems to a well known historical figure.

    ignorant? name-calling? that is your best argument? and I am ignorant? The root of ignorant is to "ignore" information / facts. What did I ignore?

    ...supposed to be patterned after the OG of wealth re-distribution to help those in need, Jesus.

    Jesus was in favor of GIVING and never taking. He told the rich man to GIVE to the poor, AND THEN follow Jesus.

    Jesus did not go to Caesar and tell him to TAKE from the rich and do whatever Caesar wants to do with the money. He did not tell the govt to take from the rich for the benefit of those in power. Jesus knew that "taking" was the same as stealing.

    Jesus was Pro-Freedom. He knew that people should be free to GIVE their money to the people they want to GIVE it to. The left wants to force people to be turned into machines that are never allowed to own their money, whereas all money belongs to the people in power (govt) and only the govt will get to decide who get the money in the end. For instance, their rich insurance friends through the health insurance mandates, whereby we all forced to give our money to the rich or pay a tax penalty.

    • 3 votes
    #1.31 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:34 PM EST
    Un-Do-It

    I heard Marx liked peanut butter, and that he was also fond of elephants, how sad that conservatives would choose their mascot from a creature that Marx was so taken with.

    Very telling....

    I think that if Marx had known any GOP, he would have hated elephants.

    • 2 votes
    #1.32 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:37 PM EST
    Pallas Athene

    To more define my words about marx and what they exactly meant I felt the need to make this post. Many of Marx's views on socialism I disagree on, what is fascinating about his actual work is the criticisms of our beloved system, Capitalism. He very clearly laid out everything wrong with our system and where exactly it will inevitably lead , and everything he said/warned has come to fruition, look at where we are at today.

    No where in anything I posted suggest I support Marx, All I mentioned was the fact that Marx had good points about economics in general and overall social order and stability. Everything the man done was not evil, come on people how do you reason he got so many to follow his path? Because his words rung true to so many and they followed. We won the war and so we get to paint them how ever we want, but let's not lose sight of the fact that these people are humans too, and to be swayed into any kind of action, just cause is necessary. That's why they tell you to fear his name today , in hope you never see that little secret ever.

    End the fear sheeple , the red war is over, Communism fell and is proven to be a failure. The real problem is Capitalism has failed us too and the greedy people in charge, those pesky robber barons again, are repeating history once again and raping the people to appease their massive appetites for wealth and power. That's why they still fear Marx , even though he has been dead well over a century he answers everything wrong with our broken government today. Conservatives complain about distributing wealth and socialist this and marx that, the whole time taking from us and giving to the rich and corporations? Call me stupid , but society exist because we can do more together than we ever can alone, we as a society can see the sense in taking care of our weak and underprivileged and how it benefit's the whole in the long run , but how exactly do those elite butt tards running DC rationalize that money/resources better spent on the already wealthy and capable? Answer, greed corrupts absolutely , so should greed be the controlling factor in any society? I like to think not

    /end rant

    • 4 votes
    #1.33 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:39 PM EST
    Un-Do-It

    post #1.30 -

    #1.13 clearly addresses your quoted comment is an utter lie

    post #1.13 -

    This is an example of how omitting a single word from an otherwise accurate quote can twist the meaning so completely as to reverse it. Here's what Obama meant to say

    MEANT to say?????

    No Christian would ever even think to say anything close to what President Obama said.

    Perception Dominates Reality - you are not a Christian, so you do not speak for other Christians and would not know what a Christian that loves Jesus is supposed to say. It is not surprising that Presidential nominees pretend to be Christian to get their votes. Romney does it every day, just like President Obama. The reason is that the majority in this country still wants to be Christian or is Christian.

    • 3 votes
    #1.34 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:47 PM EST
    Pallas Athene

    it's far more noble of a society to strive for Peace , Education and a Better way of life for all those in it. Than it is to be a society based on fears, irrationality , Ideology and war. Conservatives have no problem spending money on a Imperialistic Theocratic Warmachine, don't come up with BS about giving, it's sad to see more willing for the huge sums that get pumped into our Military every year for more war, when all of that money could solve EVERY problem we have here, and the kicker is it's OUR MONEY, not the corporations, not the rich and it's our lives. One way of spending get's us a paradise, the other blood, tears pain and suffering, unless of course you are rich, seems like a easy choice we should go the route best for everyone, right?

    • 2 votes
    #1.35 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:51 PM EST
    Un-Do-It

    post 1.33

    ...come on people how do you reason he got so many to follow his path?

    He lied to them. The people believed in Marx (as their lord and savior) and did not believe in Jesus. The people wanted to hear the lies Marx told and were not willing to see the truth. That is why we can ever only listen to what a politician is saying, but we must look at their record, and then logically determine if it is even possible to get the things the politician says they can give us. Some things are impossible (without God) like world peace. We have over 6,000 years of history to prove the fact that as long as everybody chooses to follow evil gods while rejecting the only good God, we will never have world peace.

    • 2 votes
    #1.36 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:56 PM EST
    Un-Do-It

    Conservatives have no problem spending money on a Imperialistic Theocratic Warmachine...

    The Constitution proves for a defense of this nation. We have to pay to defend our people. Then again not everyone wants to pay to protect our citizens.

    How much money would you say we should spend per person to protect them from being murdered by evil terrorists? How much is a citizen's life worth to you?

    Abortion doctors have set the price at about $2,000, do you agree? Disagree?

    • 2 votes
    #1.37 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:01 PM EST
    LordFluffy

    No Christian would ever even think to say anything close to what President Obama said.

    Hrm... are you familiar with the "No True Scotsman" fallacy?

    We aren't a Christian nation. We are nation where there are a large number of Christians, but we have no state religion by design. We're a nation of people who love freedom, and we are secular nation. And the believers within the borders of our country are not, nor have the been for sometime, possibly ever, exclusively Christian; that fact does not diminish their rights.

    In short, yes, if a person were being honest, they would have to say that we are not a Christian nation, regardless of their personal religious preference. The only people I hear or see saying such a thing are people who hope that if they keep repeating it, it will become true.

    We are a country that has space for Christians of all denominations to practice as they choose. And Jews, the same. And Muslims. And Hindus. And Buddhists. And Pagans. And Atheists. And Agnostics. And Subgeni. And none of them are less American because they do not belong the the religion or denomination that someone else might find more acceptable.

    A Christian would say that, because if for no other reason, a Christian, President Barack Obama said it.

    Now just to check, what's this got to do with the complete nonsense asserted in the above article?

    • 5 votes
    #1.38 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:04 PM EST
    LordFluffy

    Hrm...

    Registered, apparently today. Saying a lot of inflammatory things and arguing with just about everyone.

    I'm sorry Un-Do-It, I thought you were a serious poster. You can ignore my previous post and continue screaming like a jackalope at the people who aren't in on the joke.

    • 6 votes
    #1.39 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:15 PM EST
    Pallas Athene

    the old defense fallacy , love that one. Yes our constitution does state the need to fund our defense. But are we spending on defense or are we spending on offense currently? Not the same thing. The cause for terrorism and the need for a massive military come from the same problem, world domination. You see for the "bigger" Capitalist states to have their pie and eat it too they need to exploit the resources of those countries they subjugate , it's not a pretty process and in doing so we naturally create dissidents while we are doing it, duh would we stand idly by whilst another nation plundered us or would we stoop to guerrilla tactics etc.

    We create this whole mess with terrorist and the need for such an army, by being offensive it typically is a by-product of your very nature. Actually defending this country would cost very little to what we spend today, we could still have the latest and greatest, the thing is they never leave home, because home is where the "defense" is supposed to take place.

    • 1 vote
    #1.40 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:24 PM EST
    Perception Dominates Reality

    Un-Do-It

    ignorant? name-calling? that is your best argument? and I am ignorant? The root of ignorant is to "ignore" information / facts. What did I ignore?

    How about the fact that people are more complicated then the little boxes you try to put them in for your political advantage? How about that for starters?

    He told the rich man to GIVE to the poor, AND THEN follow Jesus.
    Jesus did not go to Caesar and tell him to TAKE from the rich and do whatever Caesar wants to do with the money. He did not tell the govt to take from the rich for the benefit of those in power. Jesus knew that "taking" was the same as stealing.

    So he wanted those with abundance to share with those who were in need? Thank you for cementing my point.

    The left wants to force people to be turned into machines that are never allowed to own their money,

    Hyperbole much? Oh, and currency wouldn't exist without a government in the first place. I personally don't want to go back to trading chickens, mostly because I don't want to maintian & clean-up after a chicken coop.

    MEANT to say?????

    Yeah, meant to. Seeing as how all of the President's major addresses are pre-released to the media, we know that he gaffed the line slightly. And even in his gaffe it still doesn't mean what you and Texasguy are trying to make it mean. Basically your disingenuous at best.

    No Christian would ever even think to say anything close to what President Obama said.

    No True Scotsman fallacy, Fluffy got that one knocked out. Also

    Perception Dominates Reality - you are not a Christian, so you do not speak for other Christians and would not know what a Christian that loves Jesus is supposed to say.

    You don't have the slightest clue of who or what I am unless I state as such. You know, the whole annonymous internet name thing. I am a born and raised Christian. The indoctrination just didn't take on me, I am capable of critical thinking and independent thought. I still prize Jesus Christ, as he really was, as one of the icons I model my life after. I've read Thomas Jefferson's Bible 3 times in full and referenced it on many occcasions.
    Like I said, you don't know me and denigrating that I'm not a 'true Christian' because you can't contemplate someone outside the system, isn't my problem, it's yours.

    It is not surprising that Presidential nominees pretend to be Christian to get their votes.

    Not surprising at all. Pandering is effective in a mostly ignorant populace.

    Romney does it every day,

    What campaign are you paying attention to? Romney is a devout Mormon and has donated many millions to the Mormon Church to prove as much

    just like President Obama.

    Who sat in a church for 20 years each Sunday, but somehow is pretending to be Christian? @!$%#, even if he's pretending, and started going to church for years just to prep for an eventual life in politics, I'd say let's just give him the title purely for the commitment. I know you wouldn't agree, but your opinion appears to be loosely based in reality anyway, so it's mostly negligible to those who can think for themselves.

    • 2 votes
    #1.41 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 7:11 PM EST
    petridishofideas

    Oh and your other shameless lie, Texasguy01, is equally sickening. Maybe if you were capable of telling the truth people would take you serisouly.

    Have yet to find ANY who seem capable. I dealt with many of the morons on the right and have YET to find one who isnt a bald faced liar!

    • 1 vote
    #1.42 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:14 PM EST
    spankola

    The Groucho Marx quote most applicable to this article and the Wingnutz agreeing with this article is:

    "If it Looks Like a Duck, Walks Like A Duck, Sounds Like a Duck….

    ….it’s probably an idiot quacking along with his idiot friends!"


      #1.43 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:24 PM EST
      Fred Evil

      How much money would you say we should spend per person to protect them from being murdered by evil terrorists

      Considering that you are MORE likely to be hit by lightning, than die in a terrorist attack, the answer is NOT FRICKING MUCH!!

      • 1 vote
      #1.44 - Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:59 AM EST
      Cob the Crazed

      Aww Woody316, did I hit a nerve my poor little baby? All I read after , "You should keep hanging on to that victory in 2010 because" was "wah wah wah, the right is to blame for all evil, blah blah, those elected in 2010 did nothing to help create jobs, Obama did it all, wee wee, Obama is my savior, let me follow him over that nice looking cliff over there!! LOL

      • 1 vote
      #1.45 - Wed Feb 15, 2012 6:36 PM EST
      David Boddie

      Cob the Crazed

      Yep. We're all about giving credit where credit is due. Ah well, I guess we can sit back and roll in the comfort that the Republicans have reinstated our affirmation of "In God We Trust"...

      • 3 votes
      #1.46 - Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:45 PM EST
      Cob the Crazed

      Sure David, I know I'm comfortable!! Thankfully I've worked hard to become so!

      • 1 vote
      #1.47 - Tue Feb 21, 2012 5:13 PM EST
      Reply
      Borncorn

      That Catholic paragon of virtue, Newt Gingrich, is still in the race isn't he?

      • 29 votes
      Reply#2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:04 AM EST
      jmorris

      Well since Newt's previous multiple marriages weren't "in the Church", they really don't count do they?

      • 21 votes
      #2.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:22 AM EST
      FLYNAVY1

      What issue of morality does count with fundamentalist republicans?

      • 20 votes
      #2.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:12 PM EST
      hugh b

      flynavy, the only part of morality they care about is the mor part,

      mor for me, mor for me, mor for me, that they can't spell means nothing the point is still the same

      • 12 votes
      #2.3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:28 PM EST
      mountainmike-1199289

      Newt listens to Marx:

      Women should be obscene and not heard.
      Groucho Marx

      A man's only as old as the woman he feels.
      Groucho Marx

      Alimony is like buying hay for a dead horse.
      Groucho Marx

      Behind every successful man is a woman, behind her is his wife.
      Groucho Marx

      Read more:http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/g/groucho_marx.html#ixzz1mI0aXOSm

      • 18 votes
      #2.4 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:50 PM EST
      Reply
      Woody316

      I guess "religious freedoms" only matter if your Christian. Screw those Muslims that wanted a community center blocks away from ground zero or wanted to build a mosque in a neighborhood. No freedom for them, just Christians...because of all the persecution Christians recieve./s

      He can be religious without pushing his religion on others. In fact it's in the Constitution that way. To call this a "war on religious freedoms" is immature and shortsighted at best.

      • 31 votes
      Reply#3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:33 AM EST
      Un-Do-It

      We are currently at war with two countries run 100% by Muslims. Is this false?

      How many countries are we currently at war with that are run by Christians? Zero?

        #3.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:54 PM EST
        Perception Dominates Reality

        Un-Do-It
        So because the countries we're at war with have a majority religion, we're at war with that religion?? I don't see how you can push such a short-sighted thought.
        Especially since we are not a Christian Nation. Even if the majority are any religion, regardless of what it is. We are a nation based on English Common Law.
        When we went to war with Germany, was that suppsoed to be a Christian on Christian war?? Adolf Hitler was Catholic and supposedly, according to the Right fringe, we're a 'Chrisitan nation'.

        So by your terribly useless logic, we've already had our Christian on Christian war. S

        • 1 vote
        #3.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 4:06 PM EST
        agagnu

        Religions are run like a dictatorship, can you think of one that is not ?

        The Vatican is a foreign power american catholics have to answer to the pope. Are they still americans ?

        The GOP republican party is now run like a religion dictated by Norquist.

        What foreign power is norquist answerable to ?

        • 2 votes
        #3.3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 4:39 PM EST
        Borncorn

        How many countries are we currently at war with that are run by Christians?

        The largest war this Country ever was in, was against a Majority Catholic Country, Germany. Korea was not Muslim, Vietnam was not Muslim, Grenada was not Muslim, Panama was not Muslim etc.

        • 1 vote
        #3.4 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:18 PM EST
        Un-Do-It

        post 3.2

        Adolf Hitler was Catholic...

        Yeah, and all true Christians (followers of Christ) would think it is a good idea to kill Jews? May I remind you that Jesus was born a Jew. Hitler was the farthest thing from a Christian, but he lied about his religion to get elected. Sound familiar? This happens all the time even in our country among all parties. This is a Christian nation and if you want to get elected as President you would be best off to lie about your religion if it is not Christian.

        • 1 vote
        #3.5 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:06 PM EST
        Un-Do-It

        post 3.3

        Religions are run like a dictatorship, can you think of one that is not ?

        Christianity.

        Three elected leaders - God the Father, God the Son, and the Holy Spirit. It is your CHOICE to ELECT them as your leader and savior. You are never forced by any of those three to do anything you do not want to do. Like all decisions in this life, your choices have consequences, good or bad.

        • 2 votes
        #3.6 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:10 PM EST
        Un-Do-It

        post 3.4

        The largest war this Country ever was in, was against a Majority Catholic Country, Germany. Korea was not Muslim, Vietnam was not Muslim, Grenada was not Muslim, Panama was not Muslim etc.

        I said "currently". I choose my words carefully. Many war have been fought against Atheist run Communist countries like Korea, Vietnam, etc.

        As for Germany, Hitler was not Christian - see my post #3.5. Japan felt that their highest leader was a god.

        Even in that war with Germany, I would argue that our war was with the Nazi's because NOT ALL Germans agreed with the Nazi's. The leaders in Hitler's Germany took up the religion of the Nazi's and rejected the teaching of Jesus. That is the only way they could have defended the murder of Jesus' family members.

        So today, our wars are with all the people of Iraq / Afghanistan or just the Muslim leaders of those countries? Who is willing to say that these countries are not Muslim controlled? If they are not controlled by Muslims, then who does control them? Not Christians, that is for sure. If they were, they would be following Jesus and stop all violent attacks on Christians, Jews, etc.

        If Osama BinLaden was not a Muslim, then why did President Obama ensure that the terrorist leader received Muslim funeral rights? Who did President Obama find to give a terrorist Muslim funeral rights? I would think other Muslims would be offended by the President's lack of knowledge about the difference between a real and fake Muslim. Maybe President Obama feels that Osama really was a Muslim. I would never think that Hitler should have Catholic funeral rights.

        I am not a Catholic, so I can not speak for them as a religious group.

        • 2 votes
        #3.7 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:27 PM EST
        Borncorn

        Vietnam was an atheist Country? You loose a lot of credibility with statement like that. Those weren't atheists setting themselves on fire in the 60's.

        Who did President Obama find to give a terrorist Muslim funeral rights?

        Probably one of the many Muslims in our armed forces fighting for our Country. Wasn't the first American casualty in the Iraq war a Muslim?

        • 2 votes
        #3.8 - Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:05 AM EST
        jmorris

        The leaders in Hitler's Germany took up the religion of the Nazi's and rejected the teaching of Jesus. That is the only way they could have defended the murder of Jesus' family members.

        My you are cute when you are silly.

        Check your history, there have been *many* ways people have "defended the murder of Jesus' family members" throughout history.

        And as far as Hitler and the Nazi's not being "Christians" (not *my* kind of Christians I can tell you), of course they *considered* themselves "Christian", just as the Slave Owners of the Old South considered themselves "good Christians".

        After all the belt buckles of every German soldier had the motto "God is With Us" and the vast majority of everyday Germans who supported Hitler and Nazism identified themselves with Christianity (Protestant or Catholic). Yes, even the ones who turned Gypsies and Jews over to the SS. Even the ones who ran the camps where millions of people (not just Jews) died.

        • 3 votes
        #3.9 - Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:13 AM EST
        Reply
        lib50

        I wouldn't be so quick to judge this issue. I see this as a war on women from religious organizations and the republicans. I don't think I'm the only one either. I'm pretty confident if the right wants to restrict women's ability to manage her health, it will backfire on them.

        • 27 votes
        Reply#4 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:35 AM EST
        Becks72

        Is that the best you can come up with? Are you suggesting we elect another "Christian" thief like Bush or one of the current caste of clowns running. I would gladly vote for a true conservative Republican. One who decided he would run and wasn't "told to" by GOD. Having been a Republican for fifty years I'm saddened that the party of my fore fathers has been taken over by quacks and religious perverts. I will vote for the lesser of two evils!

        • 27 votes
        Reply#5 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:40 AM EST
        Woody316

        I will vote for the lesser of two evils!

        Hope that means Obama can expect your vote.

        • 11 votes
        #5.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:42 AM EST
        douglasq

        Are you suggesting we elect another "Christian" thief like Bush or one of the current caste of clowns running.

        All of whom personify the old saying, "There is no honor among thieves."

        • 17 votes
        #5.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:54 AM EST
        Reply
        ScienceGuy-356641

        Sanctimonious, chest-thumping conservative politicians and pundits indignantly proclaim that their religious views on sexual morality and procreation are being violated by the Obama Administration.

        Of course, the reality is that many women take birth control pills as a means to regulate hormonal imbalances, not for preventing pregnancy per se. Should an employer who is a Jehovah's Witness be allowed to deny health coverage for blood transfusions and organ transplants?

        Reality check -- most Americans, including Catholics, support the use of contraceptives. Last time I checked, the United States was a Democratic Republic, not a Christian theocracy.

        • 36 votes
        Reply#6 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:06 PM EST
        kj031056-1

        Sanctimonious, chest-thumping conservative politicians and pundits indignantly proclaim that their religious views on sexual morality and procreation are being violated by the Obama Administration.

        To the Catholic USBB - you can't make the rules, when you aren't even in the game.....

        • 11 votes
        #6.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:45 PM EST
        waukone

        Science guy - I agree they opened a door that says just that. How about the scientologists? How about the moonies? What about christian scientists - some of whom have already been prosecuted because of deaths because of procedures their religion didn't believe in. Do they get a pardon now?

        • 4 votes
        #6.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:26 PM EST
        Randy McMurphy

        Marx had some good points... for instance,

        "The necessaries of life occasion the great expense of the poor. They find it difficult to get food, and the greater part of their little revenue is spent in getting it. The luxuries and vanities of life occasion the principal expense of the rich . . . . It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion."

        • 2 votes
        #6.3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:53 PM EST
        Reply
        Syntactic Tree

        When Karl Marx Speaks, Barack Obama Listens

        The present tense? I've heard of Republicans talking to their god, but I wasn't aware Obama has a direct line to Marx.

        • 21 votes
        Reply#7 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:14 PM EST
        mountainmike-1199289

        Well God told Bachmann, Perry and most likely Santorum to run for president. So it is my assumption God is a democrat.

        80 percent of Mormons now say they identify with or lean toward the Republican Party;

        And my bet is that for every Mormon vote Mitt gets there will be two or three Protestant fundamentalists voting against Mitt specifically because he is Mormon.

        • 10 votes
        #7.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:21 PM EST
        madvargr

        I think they're projecting again. It was Reagan who had the seances and ouija boards at the White House to talk to the dead, wasn't it?

        • 8 votes
        #7.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:26 PM EST
        waukone

        I see people haven't read Marx because it becomes very apparent Obama isn't listening to him at all. Ask the communist party or socialist party - they sure don't see him as one of their own and know that he isn't acting on their agenda.

        God I get so tired of people who quote people they have never even read or read it through the eyes that are less then objective not to mention completely out of context.

        • 8 votes
        #7.3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:29 PM EST
        Reply
        mossberg

        Disingenuous, misleading, and dishonest article and seed. Thanks to all those who provided sanity in the comments.

        • 34 votes
        #8 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:15 PM EST
        Texasguy01

        Have you ever studied the roots of his economic policies? All are based on wealth redistribution which is a central tenant of Marxism. If you examine in collective all of his policies they will all fit the Marxist model.

        • 2 votes
        #8.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:23 PM EST
        mstanley2265

        or there is .....the dynamics of the 'Robber Baron's' too. The one were only select people amass the Most wealth and are 'Above the Law" or like a dictator...

        • 15 votes
        #8.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:27 PM EST
        douglasq

        Have you ever studied the roots of his economic policies? All are based on wealth redistribution which is a central tenant of Marxism.

        All economic policies are based on redistribution of wealth, Marxist or otherwise. That is a meaningless statement.

        But, by today's standards, Reagan, Nixon and Eisenhower were Marxists.

        • 35 votes
        #8.3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:27 PM EST
        Colonial82

        Have you ever studied the roots of his economic policies? All are based on wealth redistribution which is a central tenant of Marxism. If you examine in collective all of his policies they will all fit the Marxist model.

        Texasguy,

        I am pretty sure Jesus believed in wealth redistribution, but I guess Jesus was a socialist and a Marxist. Why must you call him asking like Marx but not like Jesus? Jesus predated Marx by 1,900 years.

        Oh and I guess the Vatican & the Pope are followers of Marx since the Pope has made excessive wealth a sin. The Vatican also believes that all nations should provide universal health-care to all their citizens. The Vatican also believes in global warming caused by man. Are you going to call Catholics Marxists now?

        Have a good day.

        • 30 votes
        #8.4 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:18 PM EST
        hvymtl83

        @Colonial82 - Ouch, that one left a mark.

        • 16 votes
        #8.5 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:28 PM EST
        hugh b

        ok genius do you understand that capitalism requires the circulation of money, that produces goods and services, that produces money...

        choke off or concentrate the capital in too few hands you destroy capitalism

        and anyone that thinks that regulations aren't required to protect the process is galactically naive, and if anyone thinks you don't need to protect people, animals, and the planet with laws and regulations is criminally insane

        • 16 votes
        #8.6 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:32 PM EST
        mountainmike-1199289

        So who started the class warfare? Ever look at the statistics, charts, factual evidenced? Apparently not. The class warfare is there whether we want to recognize it or not, and the super rich have been winning that war for years. Some Republicans take issue when other recognize the BS game they are playing.

        Wikipedia has good articles on wealth/income disparity.

        Follow the factual evidence is like following you nose, whereas the Republican talking points about wealth/income disparity do not relate to factual evidence at all.

        Almost all Republicans signed Grover Norquist's pledge, then afterward Grover mentions that taxes on the non rich don't count. So what we have is a bunch of Norqbot Republicans in congress, and Grover is the high profile member of ALEC. Basically ALEC/ the Koch brothers own the Republican Party.

        http://alecexposed.org/wiki/What_is_ALEC%3F#What_is_ALEC.3F

        They have taken lobbying to the next highest level with legislation that is written/outlined by the corporations themselves, then they seek out legislators that will sponsor their bill for the right amount of money.

        Who should you worry about Karl or Groucho Marx or the Koch brothers?

        • 12 votes
        #8.7 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:07 PM EST
        beej mcl

        The Preamble to the United States Constitution is a brief introductory statement of the Constitution's fundamental purposes and guiding principles. It states in general terms, and courts have referred to it as reliable evidence of, the Founding Fathers' intentions regarding the Constitution's meaning and what they hoped the Constitution would achieve.

        it reads

        We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

        promoting the general welfare puts the needs of the nation as a whole over the needs of any one individual. the intent of the founding fathers included the redistribution of wealth when needed to preserve and secure our liberty.

        marx could have gotten his ideas from our founding fathers? his view of capitalism is sadly a picture of what has happened to our economy.

        Marx's view of capitalism was two sided.[3][91] On one hand, Marx, in the 19th century's deepest critique of the dehumanising aspects of this system, noted that defining features of capitalism include alienation, exploitation and recurring, cyclical depressions leading to mass unemployment; on the other hand capitalism is also characterised by "revolutionizing, industrializing and universalizing qualities of development, growth and progressivity" (by which Marx meant industrialisation, urbanisation, technological progress, increased productivity and growth, rationality and scientific revolution), that are responsible for progress.[3][91][114] Marx considered the capitalist class to be one of the most revolutionary in history, because it constantly improved the means of production, more so than any other class in history, and was responsible for the overthrow of feudalism and its transition to capitalism.[117][137] Capitalism can stimulate considerable growth because the capitalist can, and has an incentive to, reinvest profits in new technologies and capital equipment.[127]

        According to Marx capitalists take advantage of the difference between the labour market and the market for whatever commodity the capitalist can produce. Marx observed that in practically every successful industry input unit-costs are lower than output unit-prices. Marx called the difference "surplus value" and argued that this surplus value had its source in surplus labour, the difference between what it costs to keep workers alive and what they can produce.[3] Marx's dual view of capitalism can be seen in his description of the capitalists: he refers to them as to vampires sucking worker's blood, but at the same time,[114] he notes that drawing profit is "by no means an injustice"[3] and that capitalists simply cannot go against the system.[117] The true problem lies with the "cancerous cell" of capital, understood not as property or equipment, but the relations between workers and owners – the economic system in general.[117]

        At the same time, Marx stressed that capitalism was unstable, and prone to periodic crises.[4] He suggested that over time, capitalists would invest more and more in new technologies, and less and less in labour.[3] Since Marx believed that surplus value appropriated from labour is the source of profits, he concluded that the rate of profit would fall even as the economy grew.[102] Marx believed that increasingly severe crises would punctuate this cycle of growth, collapse, and more growth.[102]Moreover, he believed that in the long-term this process would necessarily enrich and empower the capitalist class and impoverish the proletariat

        • 7 votes
        #8.8 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:11 PM EST
        Rorschach-558483

        which is a central tenant of Marxism.

        Marx was a landlord?

        The word is tenet. I wouldn't bring it up if you weren't trying to convince me that you know something.

        • 2 votes
        #8.9 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:42 PM EST
        Un-Do-It

        Coloniel82 #8.4

        I am pretty sure Jesus believed in wealth redistribution...

        Never by force! Jesus said to the rich..."GIVE to the poor, and then FOLLOW me."

        Jesus never said that govt should TAKE any money to give to the poor. Jesus was a supporter of Freedom to only GIVE your money to the people you want to GIVE it to.

        The left always lies about Jesus to support TAKING from people to give it to their rich friends like insurance companies (health insurance mandates), car companies (mileage mandates), green corporations, union bosses, contraceptive sales corporations, abortion corporations, etc.

        • 1 vote
        #8.10 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 4:43 PM EST
        agagnu

        Capitalism thrives, long live capitalism, down with Romney and all vulture capitalists.

        Marx would be against them had he lived today, and if people are against vulture capitalism, they too are marxist.

          #8.11 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 4:49 PM EST
          Colonial82

          The left always lies about Jesus to support TAKING from people to give it to their rich friends like insurance companies (health insurance mandates), car companies (mileage mandates), green corporations, union bosses, contraceptive sales corporations, abortion corporations, etc.

          Un Do-it,

          Who say I was on the left? HAAHAHHA......I am not even a Democrat let alone on the left. I get it, anyone who disagrees with you must be on the left.

          Jesus was a supporter of Freedom to only GIVE your money to the people you want to GIVE it to.

          Hmmmm, I guess I missed that in my 12 years of religion classes. Can you show me where Jesus said that in the Bible?

          Never by force! Jesus said to the rich..."GIVE to the poor, and then FOLLOW me."

          Who said anything about force? Taxes are not by force and Jesus did tell us to pay our taxes.

          Have a good day.

          • 2 votes
          #8.12 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:00 PM EST
          Un-Do-It

          beej mcl #8.8

          promoting the general welfare puts the needs of the nation as a whole over the needs of any one individual.

          Not by force.

          Additionally, promoting the general welfare means we should promote only what is best for the individuals in our country, like protecting individuals from terrorist groups, protecting individuals from groups that hate certain religions or ethnic groups, protecting the weakest individuals in our society (disabled and babies) from groups that want to hurt or kill them.

          Additionally, promotion does not require money. You CAN speak while promoting an idea without spending any money. The Constitution was not written so that you could force people to pay for the desires of any one religion, like the atheists want.

          Also, you can not violate one part of the Constitution so that you can "promote the general welfare" - ie - Congress shall pass no law respecting religion or the free practice thereof. The best way to "promote the general welfare" would be to never violate the Constitution.

            #8.13 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:00 PM EST
            Rorschach-558483

            Un-Do-It

            Jesus was a supporter of Freedom to only GIVE your money to the people you want to GIVE it to.

            Really?

            That's creative. It's also a fabrication that you won't find anywhere in the Bible.

            How can you have a shred of conscience remaining and spout this garbage?

            • 3 votes
            #8.14 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:41 PM EST
            Un-Do-It

            post #8.12

            Hmmmm, I guess I missed that in my 12 years of religion classes. Can you show me where Jesus said that in the Bible?

            Who said anything about force? Taxes are not by force and Jesus did tell us to pay our taxes.

            Have a good day.

            post #8.14

            Really?

            That's creative. It's also a fabrication that you won't find anywhere in the Bible.

            How can you have a shred of conscience remaining and spout this garbage?

            Not forced - taxes? You mean I have a choice to pay my taxes? I do not think the IRS would agree with you. Maybe they should audit you?

            Jesus said "Give unto Caesar whatever belongs to Caesar and give unto God whatever belongs to God."

            You can put any name in for Caesar. Give to me whatever belongs to me. In other words - DON't TAKE from me what belongs to me. The point Jesus successfully made was that whatever belongs to you, belongs to you. and anything that belongs to God belongs to Him.

            Jesus never used to word "take" because Jesus knew that is wrong to take from people. It is stealing. Show me where Jesus said take. I proved "give", now you prove "take".

            Jesus did not say to pay your taxes. He said GIVE to Caesar whatever belongs to Caesar. Jesus said this because he was smarter than the people trying to trick Him into saying "pay your taxes no matter how high they get and no matter how evil your leader is." Jesus was not about to lie to the people.

            Our government takes from the people against their will and then gives the money to the friends of government. Prove that I am wrong.

            That is why the Constitution only says that government needs to "provide" for the defense of this country. This govt is not required to "provide" for anything else. Provide means pay for it.

              #8.15 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:45 PM EST
              Colonial82

              Un-Do-it,

              If you don't want to pay taxes in the US, there are over 200 other nations in this country but any nation that does have taxes is usually a 3rd world nation. Taxes are part of being a citizen. If you don't want to pay taxes, you don't have to be a citizen anymore.

              And give to Casear was talking about paying taxes. Jesus was NEVER anti-tax. Please show me in the Bible where Jesus was anti-tax. Show me in the Bible where he was about "freedoms".

              Our government takes from the people against their will and then gives the money to the friends of government. Prove that I am wrong.

              No, I do not have to. You are the one making outrageous claims, therefore you need to show proof of this claim. Please provide proof, this is how it works on Newsvine. Since you are new, you might not know how it works on Newsvine.

              P.S. Taxes are not taking from someone against there will. I pay my taxes because I am a proud American and I am doing my civic duty so I can have a strong nation.

              Have a good day.

              • 3 votes
              #8.16 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:27 PM EST
              mstanley2265

              uhhh you left out part of that section of the Constitution to wit:

              Section 8. The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States;

              • 4 votes
              #8.17 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:27 PM EST
              Reply
              concerned67

              I love it. The insurance companies can write a policy for using contraceptives and the Catholic people can take out the policy. They are not required to take that policy.

              The Catholic Church started all this sh--it and now it has come back to bit them in the a---ss not Obama. You can molest boys and have sex with young girls and nuns who probably used constraceptives, but it better not be in our insurance policy. We can turn over Gods chosen people, the Jews, to Nazis to be sent to death camps, but damn we can't have an insurance policy that pays for contraceptives. Anybody else that pulled this crap would have been arrested and thrown in jail. But the church can do anything they want. People are not dumb and they can see threw this. Many Many Catholic women I know use contraceptives. All the Catholic Church is doing is driving them away by bring all this up.

              • 15 votes
              Reply#9 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:43 PM EST
              Un-Do-It

              Many Many Catholic women I know use contraceptives. All the Catholic Church is doing is driving them away by bring all this up.

              That is pro-freedom. Each person should be free to pay for the religion of THEIR choice.

              At least the Catholic church is not forcing Atheists to pay for Bibles as historical reference books and life improving tools. The Atheists have opened the door for religions to force the public (through Presidential edict) to pay for the tools of one religious group.

                #9.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:06 PM EST
                petridishofideas

                undo......the gNOp ARE trying to force the rest of us into their very narrow minded and small soul kind of hell-fire and brimstone religious views. Look at frothy.....so anti-gay and abortion he has to be closeted and scared and doesn't want abortions but he and his wifey decided for one when she was ill. REGARDLESS of anything else, inducing labor on a fetus YOU KNOW FOR A FACT (she was a nurse) CANNOT SURVIVE is an abortion and late termt to boot! They want the rest of this country to have to follow the constraints their religion places on their parishners. NO THANKS.......freedom of religion. I preefer pagan to their (non)Christian views. Please show me one who actually follows the lessons of Jesus. Can't find one...there isn't any!

                • 1 vote
                #9.2 - Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:16 AM EST
                Reply
                kj031056-1

                How can Pres Obama LISTEN to Karl Marx.....the man has been DEAD for 129 years......

                How can Pres Obama follow Saul Alinsky.....the man has been DEAD for 40 years......

                So, basically this is the OPINION of someone who disagrees with Pres Obama and has absolutely no truth in it......Got it.....

                • 24 votes
                Reply#10 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:43 PM EST
                hugh b

                ok, move along, no fair bringing facts into the discussion, no soup for you

                • 13 votes
                #10.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:32 PM EST
                kj031056-1

                Ha, I have an emergency supply of homemade soup, for just such occaisions.....LOL

                • 9 votes
                #10.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:47 PM EST
                hugh b

                Ha, yourself kj, now they are coming for your soup supply, lol, good post

                • 1 vote
                #10.3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:18 PM EST
                Reply
                thelopes

                This is as blatant a violation of the First Amendment’s guarantee to religious “free exercise” as we’ve ever seen.

                If this is such a horrible violation - what about all the states that currently have these requirements?

                • 17 votes
                Reply#11 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:45 PM EST
                madvargr

                I'm still waiting for them to finish the thought - if churches can run a business and ignore aspects of labor law that conflict with their ideology, what is to stop them from denying a job to a woman or someone of a different color? What is to stop them from ignoring the minimum wage and work safety laws because their religion tells them it is bad???

                It is nothing more than a made up talking point for the sole purpose of inflaming the christofascists who vote in the GOP primaries.

                • 8 votes
                #11.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:31 PM EST
                mstanley2265

                to beat all....they were For insurance coverage for birth control Before they were Against it.

                • 5 votes
                #11.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:32 PM EST
                Reply
                echo82

                Why do we rarely hear people (especially conservatives) complaining about the redistribution of our tax dollars to wealthy individuals/corporations? Not a problem?

                • 19 votes
                Reply#12 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:46 PM EST
                hugh b

                lol, now that is a good question? soup for you

                • 11 votes
                #12.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:33 PM EST
                kj031056-1

                Why is it called "trickle down economic principles" when the money goes to the top 1% and called "redistribution of wealth" when the money goes to the bottom 99%?

                Now, can I have some soup too?

                • 14 votes
                #12.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:49 PM EST
                mountainmike-1199289

                It is more accurately called a trickle UP economy. Look at the statistics, charts, factual evidence.

                Reagan and the two Bushes are the role model voodoo trickle down presidents, all with tax cuts to the rich, tax loopholes/subsidies for corporations with over the top excessive military spending. They account for $9.2 trillion of the national debt, over $11 trillion with interest added in. That's about 73 percent of the entire national debt from just three Republican presidents.

                Republicans need to go back to Eisenhower for their icon fiscal conservative. He paid down most of the huge war/national debt in his two terms in office and we had one of our very best economies ever. The gross domestic product was growing in leaps and bounds, there was near full employment producing tangible goods with no outsourcing. But the reason Republicans don't want to remember Ike is that he taxed the rich and the corporations at over double the current level. Eisenhower was clear about the war debt, that non rich Americans sacrificed themselves, their lives and risk of severe injuries for the war and no one should be making huge profits while America was in the war or paying off the war debt. In short, Eisenhower is the bold face case in point against trickle down.

                If Republicans need more convincing about trickle down voodoo economics, read the articles, book, interviews of David Stockman, who was Reagan's budget director. He is against extending tax cuts for the rich and admits that the Republican Party has tanked the economy.

                It's called the 21st century and time to update your basic economic concepts beyond the 1980's and trickle down and the 1920's and deregulation.

                • 5 votes
                #12.3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:32 PM EST
                Un-Do-It

                Why do we rarely hear people (especially conservatives) complaining about the redistribution of our tax dollars to wealthy individuals/corporations? Not a problem?

                Yes, it is a problem. That was the complaint of the TEA Party. Stop re-distributing our money to the benefit of the rich corporations like insurance companies (health insurance mandate of the Obama Admin).

                Taxed Enough Already = TEA. Stop the spending increases and hidden forms of added taxes for the benefit of the rich Wall St and insurance corporations.

                The Democrats controlled all of the Congress and President - did they give all of Americans the same health insurance they currently get? NO! They gave us some cheep excuse for insurance. We pay for it and they get re-elected so they can keep giving our money to the richest insurance companies.

                  #12.4 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:11 PM EST
                  hugh b

                  soup for all, but out of the same can, lol

                  • 1 vote
                  #12.5 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:19 PM EST
                  kj031056-1

                  Canned soup? Keep it!

                  • 1 vote
                  #12.6 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:37 PM EST
                  echo82

                  Un-Do-It: and so what are TP doing about the redistribution of wealth to the benefit of rich corporations/individuals? haven't heard ANY of the TP elected even mentioning it. and the TP talking heads in the media? haven't heard them speaking of it either. stop trying to twist this. TP/GOP cannot have it both ways on this. they are diabolically opposed to tax hikes on the rich. problem is the majority of americans do not support that stance. time for compromise, it's way overdue.

                  • 2 votes
                  #12.7 - Tue Feb 14, 2012 1:26 PM EST
                  Reply
                  willard

                  One needs to have empathy for the poor uneducated old white males. They're angst has to do w/ the fact they failed in school and have miserable jobs and family life. If it weren't for their spouses who actually have had some success with education, they'd all be on food stamps. (As it is, we know there are more whites on food stamps than other races) I live in WNC and I know of what I speak.

                  trying to frame this as a commie plot, comes off as raw stupidity. The law has been in effect since before Bush. Where was the outcry then.

                  He has foolishly gone to war in an election year with tens of millions of Catholics, Protestants and Jews – Democrat, Republican and independent alike. He has thrown down a radical feminist gauntlet and dared the Church to pick it up.

                  Nice to know this is just one big lie; a myth believed by the bubble group that calls itself christian/republican/teabag/texasguy - all w/ Obama derangement syndrome. Some much support has come forward with his slight revision to appease the goofballs like texasguy. Every catholic woman I know practices the rhythm method HAHA. 98% want birth control.

                  CPAC was such a wonderful display of racial BS along with white supremacy being exposed, I have about come to having a bit of compassion for such fools.

                  Finally, christianity is more and more irrelevant today. If you think American women are ready to be entirely barefootand pregnant, you really are sick with ODS. Keep the bubble going texas guy - your republican/teabag/christian BS is a wonderful exercise in stupidity. Besides, its a proven economic theory that children w/ lots of kids are better off financially - just look at mittens - Gee Texasguy, if you could have more than 5 kids you'd be richer than mittens.

                  • 17 votes
                  Reply#13 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:46 PM EST
                  waukone

                  CPAC speechs scare the He!! out of me. Did you hear them. Not to mention the neo-nazi organizations that were on the panel.

                  Unfortunately Obama's re-election isn't a slam dunk - if you don't want the science, evolution, secular hating taliban more in the gov then they already are be prepared to vote, take people to vote and kick these guys out.

                  • 2 votes
                  #13.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:36 PM EST
                  Reply
                  tesla013Expand Comment Comment collapsed by the community

                  He's a Muslim what care have he for the infidel??

                  • 2 votes
                  Reply#14 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:11 PM EST
                  Randy McMurphy

                  Tes you aren't suggesting the President is a muslim are you? That would be some funny bullchit right there...

                  • 5 votes
                  #14.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:49 PM EST
                  tesla013

                  It is not a suggestion Randy.

                    #14.2 - Wed Feb 15, 2012 2:57 PM EST
                    Reply
                    RI Mom

                    The MORE the Catholic Church protests, the MORE attention they bring to their less than honorable cover-ups.

                    CLEARLY, their brethren is using birth control.

                    Denying them that insurance access in the name of dogma....then claiming that this pass-through transfer is wrong makes no sense to me.

                    It is the Church Bishops who repeatedly transferred an errant priest to another parish.

                    • 14 votes
                    Reply#15 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:13 PM EST
                    Rick_Parry_Sux

                    If the government would take religious organizations tax exemptions away then the interfering bastards would STFU and leave the reality-based alone.

                    • 9 votes
                    Reply#16 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:14 PM EST
                    tesla013

                    Reality based defined as liberals correct?

                    hehehehehehehehe

                    • 1 vote
                    #16.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:23 PM EST
                    Reply
                    trm2008

                    I thought Karl Marx was dead. These articles get more delusional all the time.

                    • 20 votes
                    Reply#17 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:23 PM EST
                    hugh b

                    desperation is a stinky cologne

                    • 13 votes
                    #17.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:34 PM EST
                    Reply
                    Jackie-355788

                    Stuff it with the commie @!$%# already. Nobody is buying that crap because Obama is in the middle and you right wing nut jobs can't figure that out until you want to run nationally but it's too late your boxed in a corner and people in the middle are turned off by your rhetoric so republicans are screwed.

                    • 12 votes
                    Reply#18 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:26 PM EST
                    Un-Do-It

                    #1.5 – Pallas Athene

                    Marx was spot on about many things, many colleges around the world study his works still to this day as he was a brilliant man of his time, and very right about a great many things. It's only we as American's who are spoon fed propaganda all our lives that see this man as some kind of adolph hitler redux, it's sad really.

                    The fundies are dividing America once again, it's true the wingnuts don't support Obama as the OP says, but lets cut the BS, the fact is they NEVER did. Obama didn't need them his first election , he will not need them in this one. "The fence sitters" will decide this one, like usually, and the Zealots running things currently in the GOP are pushing the sitters over the fence right into Obamas lap.

                    Obama supporter that also praises Marx? Of course.

                      #18.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:15 PM EST
                      Reply
                      Colonial82

                      Texasguy,

                      Are you going to allow Mormons to be freed from their religious freedom restricting law too? You know the one, the one that outlawed multiple wives in the US and that went against the Mormon religion before the Civil War. If you think this law by President Obama is against religious freedom, you are for getting rid of the anti-polygamy laws too, right?

                      Are also for allowing the Muslims to have the call to prayer be allowed to be broadcast from their mosques in US cities? Many US cities forbid Muslims from having their religious freedom and I can assume you are for freeing them from this oppression. So are you saying that Muslims should be able to have their call to prayer to be heard throughout US cities multiple times a day?

                      Have a good day.

                      • 17 votes
                      Reply#19 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:27 PM EST
                      jmorris

                      Everyone knows Muslims and Mormons aren't "real" Christians, they both start with "M". We are also concerned about the Methodists, especially since they are OK with Gay Marriage and Gay Clergy. /sarc

                      • 9 votes
                      #19.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:54 PM EST
                      Texasguy01

                      Where do you think the end of the gay marriage debate will end? It will next go to plural marriage, then plural gay marriage and then to mixed species. Maybe then we can add inanimate objects to the approved list next.

                        #19.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:33 PM EST
                        Colonial82

                        Where do you think the end of the gay marriage debate will end? It will next go to plural marriage, then plural gay marriage and then to mixed species.

                        Texasguy,

                        But forbiding plural marriages is against religious freedom and the 1st amendment, are you saying it is okay taking away religious freedom from religions you disagree with?

                        Have a good day.

                        • 3 votes
                        #19.3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 9:31 PM EST
                        LordFluffy

                        Where do you think the end of the gay marriage debate will end? It will next go to plural marriage, then plural gay marriage and then to mixed species. Maybe then we can add inanimate objects to the approved list next.

                        Oh, for the love of all that's holy. I really thought we'd covered this already. But I guess it has to be said again.

                        Consenting adults.

                        Say those words with me, please: Consenting adults.

                        Can't hear them? Then I'll shout: CONSENTING ADULTS!

                        Still have a problem? How about in pig latin? Onsentingay Dultsay.

                        Maybe in French? Adultes Consentants.

                        Russian, perhaps? по обоюдному согласию.

                        German? mündigen Erwachsenen.

                        Klingon? Well, you're screwed, because I don't speak it.

                        Personally, I'm in favor of multiple person marriages. I find nothing wrong with them. Why the God fearing spiritual descendants of Solmon, Abraham and David fear multiple person relationships is beyond me. After all it involves, say it with me... CONSENTING ADULTS.

                        However, there is no evidence that it will lead to inter-species relationships because, it lacks something. Can you guess what... yes, that would be CONSENTING ADULTS.

                        Nor would it allow you to marry your furniture because you're still lacking CONSENTING ADULTS.

                        And if you're unclear on the concept of CONSENTING ADULTS, it involves all parties to the marriage being ADULTS and able to give CONSENT.

                        Corpses can't consent. Dogs can't consent. Children are not adult and cannot give informed consent. Your coffee table can't give consent. Trees can't give consent.

                        Two adult gay men can give consent, however. Two adult gay women could give consent. Or a straight woman and two straight men. Or a intersexed adult and another intersexed adult. Or three gay women. Or two bisexual men and their girlfriends. None of the above, aside from legal challenges, seems a problem to me. They all involve... well, you know.

                        So for the love of my gods and yours, will you please get it through your skull that gay marriage does not equal people marrying tractors as such a union lacks... CONSENTING... ADULTS!

                        What do we have to do? Set it to music?

                        • 6 votes
                        #19.4 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:04 PM EST
                        Reply
                        Fred Evil

                        More silliness from the extreme right, calling Obama extreme left, and ignoring reality.

                        (sigh)

                        • 17 votes
                        Reply#20 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:30 PM EST
                        btco

                        The crazier the seeds from the right here, the greater the chances President Obama will win another election.

                        • 17 votes
                        Reply#21 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:34 PM EST
                        Plantsmantx

                        Barack Obama may have just lost the election. He has foolishly gone to war in an election year with tens of millions of Catholics, Protestants and Jews – Democrat, Republican and independent alike.

                        "Going to war" by taking an anti-contraceptive position is foolish. It's 2012, not 1965.

                        But hey- I think the fact that these people don't think it's foolish is a wonderful thing.

                        • 15 votes
                        Reply#22 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:35 PM EST
                        petridishofideas

                        obama might be "waging" war with the hierarchy of the narrow religious churches but many of their women agree with obama and they are the ones who will be voting! It has been more like the religious reich trash are waging war on WOMEN and I for onw will NOT forve for them. NOT in this lifetime onr any other! IF they want to force their narrow and small souled views on me.....bring it and this granny will gladly kick their asses!!!!!

                        • 2 votes
                        #22.1 - Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:29 AM EST
                        Reply
                        voxrationis

                        Despite two pathetic feints at “compromise,” Obama’s illegal requirement that faith-based groups pay for policies providing immoral “reproductive services” remains in full force.

                        The stupidity of the Right has no bounds. If you are "imposing" something you don't "compromise" at all. Of course that last word has become foreign to most of you tools.

                        • 9 votes
                        Reply#23 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:35 PM EST
                        Un-Do-It

                        ...stupidity of the Right...

                        If you can not form a real argument, then just call people mean names. If that does not work, then what?

                        "sticks and stones ...?"

                        The Democrats did not "compromise" when the Republicans wanted to extend UI benefits and the payroll tax cuts for a whole year. The Democrats (led by President Obama) forced them to accept only a two month extension.

                          #23.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:20 PM EST
                          voxrationis

                          Not going to back off that one. Stupid is stupid. To suggest that Democrats are the ones refusing to compromise falls into that category as well.

                          • 3 votes
                          #23.2 - Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:50 AM EST
                          Reply
                          Beebobby

                          Obama has not waged war on tens of millions of Catholics, Protestants and Jews – Democrat, Republican and independent. That would be a lie.

                          • 7 votes
                          Reply#24 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:37 PM EST
                          IndependentVoter

                          Lenin is said to have declared that the best way to destroy the Capitalist System was to debauch the currency. By a continuing process of inflation, governments can confiscate, secretly and unobserved, an important part of the wealth of their citizens. There is no subtler, no surer means of overturning the existing basis of society than to debauch the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and does it in a manner which not one man in a million is able to diagnose.

                          Ominously, in 1966, Columbia University scholars Richard Cloward and Frances Piven published a theory outlining methods to destroy a healthy capitalist economy and force communist revolution. This eliminates capitalism by making impossible state budgetary demands, thereby bringing government insolvency.

                          Marx taught God doesn't exist. Religion is a lie, a tranquilizer for the masses. It cannot be tolerated since it's delusional, another way the powerful exploit the poor (Lenin sanctioned every attack against Christians, except mass extermination). It follows that no soul exists or any category of "sin."

                          Marxists insist life is only about proper distribution of wealth.

                          So, does Obama believe in the Marxist philosophy?

                          • 3 votes
                          Reply#25 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:38 PM EST
                          Plantsmantx

                          He obviously doesn't believe that God doesn't exist, so that shoots down one of your "prerequisites for Marxism" from the jump. And, if he believed that "life is only about the proper distribution of wealth", he wouldn't have delivered this windfall to private insurance companies...unless you think that's an illustration of what he believes "the proper distribution of wealth" is.

                          • 10 votes
                          #25.1 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:45 PM EST
                          Colonial82

                          So, does Obama believe in the Marxist philosophy?

                          IndependentVoter,

                          How does anything you posted have anything to do with President Obama? President Obama is not destroying capitalism. President Obama is not attacking religion, especially since he is Christian himself.

                          Actually, President Obama is acting a Christian, like how Jesus told us to act in the Bible and how the Vatican teaches us to treat others since they believe in redistribution of wealth.

                          Have a good day.

                          • 11 votes
                          #25.2 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:02 PM EST
                          madvargr

                          Richard Cloward and Frances Piven

                          Thanks for dragging out that tired old GOP talking point - now I'm getting drunk reading this seed - too many "take a shot" words are coming out...

                          • 5 votes
                          #25.3 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:34 PM EST
                          mountainmike-1199289

                          Does Obama believe in the Marxist philosophy? In contrast to whom? Republicans say they believe in free market capitalism, which refers to Adam Smith. We don't have free market capitalism, we have predatory capitalism and Wall Street giants have a small group monopoly over the financial industry. That's not free market capitalism by a wide margin. Another example would be the high price of gasoline right now, big oil making huge profits while manipulating supply and demand in their favor. Then Wall Street speculators drive up the price of gas by buying and selling it two dozen or more times before it reaches the pump. That generally DOUBLES the price. Can someone tell me how that fits "free market capitalism"?

                          • 4 votes
                          #25.4 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 2:39 PM EST
                          Texasguy01

                          I am always mentioning Cloward and Pivin as they seem to be the only consistent economic model he follows analytically.

                          • 1 vote
                          #25.5 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:36 PM EST
                          Reply
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